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Post by DAVID on May 4, 2015 21:49:31 GMT 10
Hi Tom it says on the package to administer hippiron IV unfortunately im not confident enough to administer IV so would it have the same desired effectiveness if I injected IM and can you tell me the difference in time IM would have compared to IV to have the same outcome.THANK YOU.
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Post by Tom Meulman on May 5, 2015 10:15:11 GMT 10
Hi David,
I'm sorry mate but I would be much happier if you did not use Hippiron intramuscular as there have been instances that I'm aware of where that has caused not only muscle damage, but in one instance because it was not injected deep enough it caused ulceration.
For intramuscular use a product such as Iron Dextran-200 injection is much safer because it is designed specifically for that use. However with any iron injection even when it is designed to be used intramuscular I believe it much safer if the quantity injected into any one area is limited to 1 ml only.
Iron Dextran-200 injection contains Ferric hydroxide and this is generally absorbed into the body very quickly and therefore fast acting.
The other product that may be of some interest is Ferrocyl which contains an organic arsenic, copper as well as iron, and stimulates red blood cell production faster than just iron injections on their own. Plus it has the advantage of being able to be used subcutaneously. In fact from my point of view it is a rather cleverly formulated product because the arsenic used is sodium cacodylate which is in fact a poisonous arsenic for which the antidote is Ferric chloride. So it has both the poison and the antidote in the same injection with both these substances complementary to each other but because of this combination it is low toxicity.
Cheers,
Tom
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Post by DAVID on May 5, 2015 15:41:56 GMT 10
Thank you for your reply Tom.How many hours would it take dextran-200 generally to absorb into the body.Tom seen that ferrocyl has an organic arsenic will it schwab. thank you.
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Post by Tom Meulman on May 5, 2015 20:11:23 GMT 10
Hi David,
Research into the absorption rate of iron dextran showed that the major portion was absorbed into the body during the first 72 hours.
In regard to the organic arsenic in Ferrocyl I'm not aware of anyone ever getting a positive swab to this product. However to be on the safe side allowing 72 hours after the last injection prior to racing should provide a margin of safety.
Cheers,
Tom
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Post by DAVID on May 5, 2015 21:19:22 GMT 10
Hi Tom thank you for your advice and im sorry to ask so many questions.How would you use dextran 200 in conjuction with ferrocyl.Thank You again.
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Post by Tom Meulman on May 6, 2015 13:27:19 GMT 10
Hi Tom thank you for your advice and im sorry to ask so many questions.How would you use dextran 200 in conjuction with ferrocyl.Thank You again. You would not use both products at the same time as both products have the same function, namely increasing the available iron to hopefully increase healthy red blood cell count. The only additional ingredients in Ferrocyl are copper and organic arsenic. Copper is also required for healthy red blood cells, and the arsenic is supposed to stimulate the body into manufacturing red blood cells. Like so many of the products such as these that are on the market just how effective they are also depends on other factors. One of the most important of these is kidney health as kidneys produce EPO and without EPO to stimulate red cell production iron injections have virtually no affect on the blood count. Cheers, Tom |
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Post by Guest on Aug 6, 2015 22:11:42 GMT 10
Hi Tom,
If my greyhound has a Haemoglobin level of 18.9 and is racing in 2 days would it be worth giving him a 5ml shot intra muscular a day before the race?
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Post by Guest on Aug 6, 2015 22:17:27 GMT 10
Hi Tom, If my greyhound has a Haemoglobin level of 18.9 and is racing in 2 days would it be worth giving him a 5ml shot intra muscular a day before the race? That is Ferrocyl I am talking about |
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Post by Tom Meulman on Aug 8, 2015 7:23:53 GMT 10
Hi guest,
It takes 21 days for a red blood cell to develop and therefore any iron injection close to a race is going to do very little in regard to boosting blood counts.
Because these types of injections can cause some dehydration in susceptible greyhounds where kidney function is not brilliant, and a PCV or Hct is taken prior to the injection showing a low blood count of say 55% and another 24 hours after the injection showing a PCV or Hct of 57% it would be easy to assume that the blood count had actually gone up as a result of the iron injection, when in fact the thicker blood is caused by unwanted dehydration.
Not a good result at all.
Ferrocyl while worthwhile to increase hemoglobin over a period of time will not increase it over such a short time frame. There again the arsenic compound within the formula may provide some stimulation, however it is NOT something I would recommend doing on a regular basis that close to a race as it could adversely affect the health of the greyhound.
While as far as I'm aware no positive swab has resulted from the use of a substance such as Ferrocyl there is always a possibility that it may in the future.
Cheers,
Tom
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